The topic was why it took the shitlibs and Hasanabi-watching leftists (lol) a fucking tattoo to denounce Graham Platner, an Iraq veteran who did 4 trips to the war zone and then joined the Blackwater mercenary company to kill even more people.

  • -6-6-6-@lemmygrad.ml
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    18 days ago

    ou’re behaving like a child throwing a tantrum because someone disagrees with your analysis and doubling down on idealism throughout. Sad behavior to see, I thought better of you. But I guess you are yet another victim of “westerner who hasn’t actually embodied a successful revolution looking at the world and being smug about how much better they are at morals than other people.”

    The kind of attitude you’re pulling here is cut from the same cloth as when people call AES states revisionist for not doing a full communism immediately. It comes from the same general error in thinking, of viewing the world as a composite of individual moral choices and viewing those moral choices as coming from individual will faced with the possibility to be corrupt in a very obvious way and choosing not to do the obviously wrong thing.

    “You see! Not wanting to be with soldiers who have directly contributed to the death of family abroad and the family of friends abroad is a childish tantrum doubling on idealism, despite the fact that multiple people agreed with the Myth of The Soldiertariat post you made, more people understanding the point you made, etc”

    I don’t give a fuck what you think about me. Especially when you think it’s over a disagreement with my “analysis” when it’s actually a lack of basic fuckin’ principles. Especially from someone who even comes along the same angle as the dipshits that I’ve been arguing with before. In order to have a revolution, you need to shed the fascist parts of the state and encourage the soldiers in it to engage in class suicide. That is not happening in the Imperial Core until it collapses. When it collapses, maybe I can consider working with a few soldiers who literally lost anything and everything that made them loyal to their class. Until then? There is going to be plenty who will give everything up to crush your skull underneath their boot, and I’m “emotional” because I don’t want to work with them? Fuck you.

    You don’t need to have any personal sympathy for people who commit atrocities in order to understand the dynamics of the world. You don’t need to want to personally forgive or work with people who commit atrocities in order to understand the dynamics of the world. I could go on.

    I never have to forgive anyone. Remember that. Forgiveness is never free.

    But as usual, AES states show us what real practicing communism looks like. They show us that there are times to war and there are times to persuade and negotiate, and it’s not always immediately clear which is more effective and in what way.

    What does me saying I don’t want or need to work with baby-killers involves any of this? I didn’t say anything about “AES” states. In the periphery, soldiers can absolutely have different class interests than their colonist occupiers. This is purely America, here and it’s in relation to Platner.

    It’s a highly erroneous worldview, which assumes that the world is broken up into good and evil, that everyone has the same lens and information, and that the evil people are just choosing to be evil in spite of good being an obvious option.

    In this world, I can gladly judge people for the decisions they make in the past. I never said it was “good and evil” I simply said that people are fully capable of looking past propaganda, even when their starving and in the most critical conditions and that there are plenty of people able to do that. Maybe it’s because one of the things that separates us from rabid curr is that we have principles and dogs don’t. I did it and I can gladly judge those in the military; especially when most come from “non-lumpenprole” backgrounds if you don’t consider the existence of a middle class. So the whole “good and evil” about “military propaganda” is pure clean USMC theory bullshit. Want citations? Again, fuck you.

    • amemorablename@lemmygrad.ml
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      18 days ago

      You’re still throwing a tantrum and missing the point continuously because of that fact. It’s very tiresome. I’ve put up with far too much adult child behavior in my life. Not taking it from you. Grow up or shut up.

        • amemorablename@lemmygrad.ml
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          16 days ago

          Your account is 4 years old and you’ve never read this rule of the instance?

          Be respectful. This is a safe space where all comrades should feel welcome; this includes a warning against uncritical sectarianism.

          People should try to act like adults, it’s not supposed to be a high bar for adults to meet. I can only guess you’ve never tried to organize anyone for anything if you think people being able to regulate their emotions isn’t important; that expecting them to do so is some kind of, what, liberalism? Do you want the most loud and angry people bullying their way into running things? Because not pushing back against that kind of stuff is how you get the most loud and angry people running things. I have some experience with the worst kinds of those people, up close and through others’ experiences, and if anything I’d call it liberalism to “go along to get along” with such behavior instead of pushing back against it. When those people are allowed to get away with what they do consistently, they make the world revolve around them and they get others bending over backward to soothe them. Notice how similar that description is to how young children can be, except that young children are that way because they haven’t had the chance to learn how to regulate yet, they have extra trouble communicating and advocating for their needs, and they need extra attention and care. Once you get to be an adult, the expectation is that you grow past this hyper vulnerable state.

          It doesn’t mean you’re now bootstraps as an adult. It just means people shouldn’t be having to “manage” you so that you don’t pop off and make things harder on everyone else.

          There are situations where people get upset about things in a valid way, even as an adult. And some of the stuff we are aware of in the context of a form like this one is very angering. It doesn’t change the fact that other people are not punching bags.

          It reminds of the situation I’ve also seen online where some “leftists” would throw insults at “rightists” that are meant to put them down, but are insults that end up being some kind of -ism territory in the process and are more a reinforcement of the status quo than fighting against it. In the same way, having a “leftist” message is not a shield to hide behind immature behavior. Letting people operate that way consistently enough is how you get cult of personality sectarian offshoots.

          So no, this is not “civility policing.” I didn’t demand someone say please and thank you, and only speak during their allowed five minutes duration and say their points are invalid if what they say extends beyond their five minutes. I told them to act like an adult, which is in line with the expectations of the instance’s rules.