They have ignored this request for almost 10 years. https://protonmail.uservoice.com/forums/935538-accounts-payments/suggestions/33188971-accept-monero-for-payment

Like 3 or 4 years ago, Seth said they might soon accept Monero, but they didn’t either. Proton is not too bad, to be sure, but it’s been really questionable in various ways too… Better late than never, though.

Cf. elsewhere https://l.opnxng.com/r/Monero/comments/1lmuhfi/proton_to_add_monero_support_with_1000_signatures/

I think they will be the first to have both digital ID and CBDC.

Or possibly Israel will be? Or China. Paying/Having cash may become illegal eventually.

The popularity of privacy increases as there is more and more surveillance, control and censorship by states. Privacy is also being talked about and worked towards in communities of other large networks, e.g. ADA and BCH.

Interestingly, even Zcash (a less used privacy coin) is like +60%/mo (whereas +70%/mo for Monero) against USD. A coincidence? Or a general trend?

Ah, AI-generated “cheap” text. That’d explain a lot!

In addition to what you’ve pointed out (which perhaps many Monero users agree with) such as the paper Monero issue, I’d say that fundamentally CEXes have this conflict of interest: they’re supposed to help investors or whatever, help them become rich (as if that’s the point). But reality is, often customers’ losses are their profits - that’s their (casino-like) business. In short, they essentially want you to lose your money. And in the first place, this investment aspect is not even the point of cryptocurrencies.

EU bans in 2027? - that’s old news. Already in 2022: there were anonymous accounts ban in Lithuania for example (and the remarks by US Deputy Secretary of the Treasury about “unhosted wallets” too). Basically central entities have always wanted to regulate things centrally, but that’s not how cryptos are supposed to work. I think XMR is one of the only few coins, still having this fundamental (admittedly, a bit idealistic) philosophy. Either way XMR is only a few “true” cryptos, actually being used (as opposed to just being traded as investment aka gambling). Because of that, some people, including myself, may tend to feel that Monero is essentially valuable and that the recent price movements are something that could have always happened (though, this unconscious assumption could be misleading too). So maybe… even though what’s happening now might have been triggered by some criminals, that may have been just catalysts; the cause of these price actions may be intrinsic - because Monero is valuable, it’s being valued. Perhpas a bit too optimistic view, but perhaps not entirely untrue either?

Cryptographically it’d be absurd to share your sec key with CEX (“hosted” wallet). Like 30-year-old PGP/GPG key-escrow debates yet again; or worse, not even escrow, CEX users don’t even have their keys. Which feels so absurd. I’ve never once used CEXes, except I tried no-KYC web swaps a few times (but they too are CEXes, having the same fundamental problems). Obviously pure P2P DEX solutions feel much better and safer, where Alice and Bob are mathematically / trustlessly safe as in atomic swaps or via multisigs. DEXes (e.g. Bisq, Haveno) may be for-profict business too (no free lunch), but that’s beside the point. Nevertheless, it’s important to realize that everything, including “no-KYC” or “DEX” solutions, may become “sneaky” if not scammy.

Yeah, most probably. It’s crazy, though: they’re now saying that: privacy-by-default = bad, no-privacy = good. That’s the EU for you?

That’s possible. I happened to see these weird/questionable theories elsewhere, not really convincing:

“There are also rumors that major exchanges are thinking about relisting XMR, which, when combined with Monero’s lower liquidity and more concentrated holdings, can lead to major price movements”

“Researchers say part of that growth is due to a shift in the U.S. regulatory tone. The FIT21 crypto bill is picking up steam, and the SEC is taking a step back from labeling privacy coins as securities. This seems to be helping the market out a bit. It looks like the easing of pressure has led to more money flowing back into assets like Monero”

“There is also a lot of excitement about Monero’s upcoming FCMP++ upgrade, which is expected later this year.”

https://u.today/xmr-explodes-past-350-is-monero-finally-back

“Perhaps ironically, the surge is being fueled by this regulatory purge.”

[This may be right.]

“Monero’s rise is reactive rather than entirely organic. Fearing censorship, there is a rush toward decentralization.”

https://u.today/monero-xmr-surges-with-3900-volume-skyrocketing

I HATE Reddit with a passion (censorship, bots, using our posts to train their AI and sell it to Google and now CQS which punishes you even for connecting in a non-AML/KYC way ) and wish the entire community would just migrate here or somewhere else.

Yeah, when Monero.town was born, I had hoped and kind of expected that more people were coming here ! Freedom is the core value of Monero ; no surveillance ; no censorship ; no arbitrary freezing or blocking ! It was not entirely Monero.town’s fault that that didn’t happen, that more people were not joining, except its Tor blocking was obviously preposterous, a show-stopper.

You can at least try a privacy-front end such as https://redlib.zaggy.nl/r/monero/ :) Looks like Reto isn’t working very well now…

Try not to take things too personally. Tails devs explicitly said they were making it for regular people (activists, journalists, domestic violence victims, etc.) and mainly not for advanced users. So by design it’s a normie-friendly OS (a user is not even expected to know how to use pgp); as such, one might generally assume its users may not be “geeks”. Nothing personal there.

While asking questions and exchanging ideas are wonderful, one can also enjoy the freedom to study (one of the four essential freedoms), guessing, narrowing down a problem by trial and error. An attempt at solving the problem on one’s own is often of great value, a great way to learn, even if it’s unsuccessful; after that, one might be able to ask an even better question, which could be helpful for more people too. Either way, I think that most Monero users can happily agree with each other that we want a better version of bisq :) (Sorry if this comment is uncalled for.)

Maybe this is why no one ever posts here.

Imho (quite) a few users ditched monero.town when they had started blocking Tor.

Tor Browser is planning to remove Google from the search engine options a user can choose: https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/applications/tor-browser/-/issues/41835

There some say brave onion + no JS is good: https://search.brave4u7jddbv7cyviptqjc7jusxh72uik7zt6adtckl5f4nwy2v72qd.onion/

Mullvad team seems to be considering 4 possible options:

• Startpage: https://www.startpage.com/
• Mojeek: https://www.mojeek.com/
• Brave Search: https://search.brave.com/
• Metager: https://metager.org/

PS: Not disgussing ddg / ddg onion too much, basically because ddg is the long-time default search engine of TB. Most TB users assume ddg is a decent, standard, generic option, esp. its non-JS version.

Agreed. It’s an option worth considering (even EFF said so)—in fact a bridge itself could be run by something like Team Cymru (Augury), removed in TB v11.5.4. On the other hand, a VPN could collaborate with “them” so you’ll have to trust them… adding yet another unknown.

There are many ways to de-anonymoze Tor users indeed. Like Keystroke fingerprinting or Deep Packet Inspection… Usually a local ISP is not a big problem but it depends. The fact remains that even in a country with heavy Internet censorship, currently a nation-state can’t block Tor (via Bridge or Snowflake).

Also, one should consider using Bridges (obfs4), so that your local ISP may not know you’re on Tor. Tails suggests that too. Using a VPS is not necessary a best option for that, though it might be a good option under some situation.

Actually, Proton + your local key = don’t work very good. Usually you’ll have to use a key pair generated by Proton—sharing your sec with the provider is not good.

Nevertheless, Proton is 100 times better than Google to be sure. Those who are trying to ditch Google, Proton and Tuta are two good options to consider, also recommended by PrivacyGuides. For those who had ditched Big Tech and now starting to wonder if Proton is okay… that’s a bit tricky, still I say Proton is nod bad. I had recommended Proton to my friends until the French activist incident, followed by a few more bad incidents. Yet it’s understandable that Proton must obey it if they get a valid court order… If you’re a normal, daily user, Proton is good enough (if not the best), albeit a bit overpriced.

Not a recommendation but I too trust Disroot pretty much. You can get a custom domain there without “buying a paid plan” once you make a donation. Would that be an option for you?

Using multiple providers (having multiple accounts) is a good idea, though. Don’t put all the eggs in one basket. I’ve never heard the two providers you mentioned, so I can’t tell. If you can sign up anonymously via Tor, if they’re Google-free + not behind CF, and (most importantly) if you feel them “good” (subjective but gut feeling…), I think they’re usable.

If their support use PGP, that’s a good sign too. (Proton even doesn’t share its pub key iirc.) If they also accept the privacy coin like Disroot and Tuta do, that’s nice too. Ultimately, though, believe your gut feeling, because everyone has different priorities, different threat models, etc.

While doing this is generally not recommended, EFF does indeed suggest this option in some context: https://ssd.eff.org/module/choosing-vpn-thats-right-you#things-to-consider-what-vpns-don-t-do

Don’t worry about e2ee: Even if you get the most expensive plan from e.g. Proton, it’s not e2ee unless both parties use Proton. There is a free, “easy” way to realize true e2e: OpenPGP in Thunderbird (convenient), GnuPG (more secure), etc.

As for mailbox.org: I used it before but it showed Google reCaptcha, which was an obvious red flag:
cf. [Security and GDPR Issue] ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for Login, every single time. #242

Also, technical score of mailbox.org has been relatively low, not improving: https://internet.nl/mail/mailbox.org/1080449/ (Don’t worry too much about this score, though. It’s only technical; human factors (philosophies, trust, etc.) are more important when it comes to privacy.) This is not a recommendation. DYOR; ultimately, believe your own intuition.

• Tuta (free): you can send only like 6 email per day. Otherwise, Tor-friendly. No onion. Support forum on Reddit 😞 Germany.
• Posteo.de: 1 €/mo affordable. Nothing fancy. Support via PGP like that’s common sense. Germany. Non-crypto anonymous payments w/ various options (e.g. a prepaid CC): they don’t even ask your name (much less address, cell phone number).
• Disroot.org: Free, pop/smtp, community-based, trusted even by the Tails team. w/ onion. Netherlands.
• Cock.li: Free, pop/smtp etc. Very Tor-friendly w/ fast onion. It’s good if you think it like disposal. Irresponsible in a way (aka Freedom), but actually 10-year-old & stable. Romania.
• Proton (free): bloated, very mixed opinions, yet better than Google. w/ onion (slow). Switzerland. A simple feature like Plain Text view is missing (HTML by default: not serious about privacy).

If you mean this article on Wired itself, it’s not pay walled, though annoying. Click the V (chevron) to hide the Subscribe Now thing.

Or if it’s indeed pay-walled in your area, open it via Germany by search this -> https://metager.org/meta/meta.ger3?eingabe=A Controversial US Surveillance Program May Get Slipped Into a ‘Must-Pass’ Defense Bill
find the article, and use the “OPEN ANONYMOUSLY” link. Many annoying things will be filtered too.

Confusing but the official site is not monero.com but www.getmonero.org, where you can see the full list of officially suggested wallets. Official GUI is a safe option. Feather is also good, Electrum-like.

Cake (Monero.com) is one of the suggested options too & is popular, but certainly not “most private“. With Feather, you can do everything over Tor, more privacy-friendly.

Most Monero users only use non-custodial wallets; so they just say “wallets” meaning that. Technically running a local node yourself is the most secure & private—though this option is not for everyone.

https://www.getmonero.org/

The monero.com domain has been taken by a for-profit company, Cake. The Monero community is not wealthy (nor motivated) enough to buy it back.

Let’s say I’m selling you a book B and accepting a crypto payment. What if you sent me your crypto C trusting me, but I exit-scammed, vanishing without sending you B you’re trying to buy? That’d be bad. But what if I sent you B first, trusting you’ll send me C as soon as you receive B? Now you could cheat and vanish without paying. That’d be bad too.

To prevent any of those things from happening, there are a few methods. One is a 2-of-3 escrow service. Another is 2-of-2. Both based on multisig. A simplified example follows.

The book costs you 100€. You’ll send, say, 200€ to address A controlled by both you and me via multi-signature. I too will send 100€ to A. Now Wallet A has 300€. When 2 persons (you and I) sign, there will be a 2-output transaction from A to you (100€) and to me (200€), but any single person can’t move fund from A. That’s multisig.

Now I must send you the book in a good condition, because I don’t want to lose my 100€. So I’ll act carefully and honestly, and sign when I ship the book. You too will be willing to sign when you receive the book, because otherwise you can’t retrieve your 100€ (you deposited 200, when the book only costs 100). Sometimes an unexpected accident may happen, but usually something like this will work pretty well. This is one way how a P2P platform works (not very accurate, but I hope you get the idea).